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My first four, increasingly accurate approximations to the right answer:
1. Yes.

2. No, if the underlying question is “Can I get the ‘public participation’ checkbox checked off by turning on a Twitter account?” (Not Tim’s underlying question, of course, but some people will read it this way.)

There is a lot of approach/avoidance ambivalence about social media: people see that one can set up an account or a fan page in an afternoon, but they also glimpse, more dimly, that a lot of work is required to make that useful. (Excel will help you estimate a project budget, but it won’t make the process fun or easy.)

3. No, if the real question is “Can I use social media for public involvement and still stay comfortably in control?” See Obama asking for questions via Google Moderator, only to be forced to discuss marijuana legalization . See Digg and the DVD encryption hack issue.

(Of course, social media processes can be shaped.)

4. Yes, once you understand that social media technology is a small part of the overall effort and you’ve rethought how much or little control you need over the whole process.

Bonus points for recognizing that the technology of social media is only the fourth most important concern, after you’ve identified the specific Public you want to involve, your Objectives in involving them, and your Strategy for doing so.

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This is the archive of tweets for the September 28 chat. (Archive courtesy of TwapperKeeper.)

PublicDecisionsHi everyone and welcome to this week’s #P2chat! Today we’re discussing laws/regs for p2 and also tips for public hearings/mtgs.^09/28/10 06:00 PM ET

PublicDecisionsLet‚Äôs do intros…pls tell us a little about yourself. (be sure 2 incl #P2chat in yr tweets so they‚Äôre seen by folks & 4 chat archive too)^09/28/10 06:01 PM ET

PublicDecisionsBeth Offenbacker @PublicDecisions We use techn to showcase best practices emerging trends and leading thinkers in #publicengmt #P2Chat^09/28/10 06:03 PM ET

transPRIntro: #p2chat Darrel here PR for gov clients former gov PR and former journalist^09/28/10 06:05 PM ET

citizentoolsChris Berendes CTO Netalyst #gov20 blogger techie online engagement project manager #p2chat^09/28/10 06:05 PM ET

citizentoolsRegarding laws/regs here are model laws supporting citizen assemblies & “open meeting” laws that inhibit pol participation online #p2chat^09/28/10 06:14 PM ET

PublicDecisionsWhat laws and regs are you aware of for #publicengmt? #p2chat^09/28/10 06:15 PM ET

PublicDecisionsIn the spirit of #publicengmt did you know today is Intl Right to Know Day? http://bit.ly/bqGN23 #p2chat^09/28/10 06:16 PM ET

PublicDecisionsDo you think that FOIA laws are part of the p2 spectrum…?? some see as directly rel others as adjunct to #p2chat^09/28/10 06:17 PM ET

transPR#p2chat NEPA laws re environmental reviews for projects fed laws for transportation plans at state and MPO levels.^09/28/10 06:18 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGreat p2 resource for engmt under Res Cons & Rec Act Safe Drinking Water and Clean Water Acts http://bit.ly/9r8M7L #p2chat^09/28/10 06:19 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHas anyone been following this issue? “Appeals court rejects public comment time” http://www.thataway.org/?p=2376 #p2chat^09/28/10 06:21 PM ET

transPR@PublicDecisions Important to have a system to collect the comments that are required and document efforts. #p2chat^09/28/10 06:21 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGreat post on @NCDD blog New Resource on Legislation Supporting Citizen Participation http://bit.ly/cVvO7q #p2chat^09/28/10 06:23 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions Haven’t followed the FL issue. Speaks to the need for some definitions and also expectations #p2chat^09/28/10 06:24 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGood resource on p2 laws/regs in China http://www.greenlaw.org.cn/enblog/?p=2377 #p2chat^09/28/10 06:25 PM ET

transPRWho knew? RT @PublicDecisions: Good resource on p2 laws/regs in China http://bit.ly/9aQ2nE #p2chat^09/28/10 06:27 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions Have you run into legal issues pro or con in your work? #p2chat^09/28/10 06:28 PM ET

PublicDecisions@transPR NEPA is a good one; SAFETEALU also has req. (Isn’t SL up for reauth? Any changes on p2 in new law being talked abt?) #p2chat^09/28/10 06:28 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools we should organize a study trip to check out the Tuscan law must be more to it that needs examination! #p2chat^09/28/10 06:29 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Lawsregs req p2 are good set standard…but also lead 2 tendency 2″check the box” IMHO. Shld be starting pt not end #p2chat^09/28/10 06:31 PM ET

PublicDecisions@transpr do you see particular trends in p2 in transportation as compared to other fields? #p2chat^09/28/10 06:32 PM ET

PublicDecisions…meaning in terms of what’s required by law or reg #p2chat^09/28/10 06:32 PM ET

transPR@PublicDecisions #p2chat stimulus set a new path for transp documentation and transparancy. Could show up in new auth.^09/28/10 06:33 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat the limit of laws is that short of the jury system you can’t mandate impact^09/28/10 06:33 PM ET

PublicDecisionsPDF report: Public Participation In The Enforcement Of China’s Anti-Pollution Laws http://bit.ly/cUgWrz #p2chat #environmental #publicengmt^09/28/10 06:35 PM ET

PublicDecisionsWhat pointers and best practices do you have from your work in terms of public hearings/mtgs? #p2chat^09/28/10 06:36 PM ET

PublicDecisionsthis would be gr8 step 4ward! RT @transPR: #p2chat stimulus set new path 4 transp documentation & transp. Cld show up in new transp auth^09/28/10 06:38 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHere’s 1…may be obvious…create a conv about the values that underpin subject first perhaps prehearing coffee klatch #p2chat^09/28/10 06:40 PM ET

PublicDecisionsSets the stage for ppl to think about why they care about issue and puts folks on same page before formal part of mtg begins #p2chat^09/28/10 06:40 PM ET

citizentoolsHave there been public hearings “in the round”? the usual set-up is hierarchical and often adversarial #p2chat^09/28/10 06:43 PM ET

transPR@PublicDecisions #p2chat trend is going beyond what’s required by law. Some govs doing so others wed to past. Public expecting more.^09/28/10 06:44 PM ET

PublicDecisionsthanks @transpr! great to have you as part of discussion as always #p2chat^09/28/10 06:47 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools so often orientation around preventing contr rather than creating learning oppty. Collab shld begin long b4 pub hring #p2chat^09/28/10 06:49 PM ET

PublicDecisionsBlding on that another best practice I see is having hearing as culmination of lengthy process not one-off activity #p2chat^09/28/10 06:50 PM ET

PublicDecisionsBeyond the Public Hearing—Tools for Better #PublicEngmt fr Wyoming Assn of Municipalities http://bit.ly/8ZMPn9 #p2chat^09/28/10 06:53 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions are you aware of any research on what actually happens in say Senate hearings and how to “win” them? #p2chat^09/28/10 06:54 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools wld be interestd in yr insights on good tips for public mtgs hearings. what works best? #p2chat^09/28/10 06:54 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools have not seen any data on that wld be good Q for researchers that focus on political side of engmt tho #p2chat^09/28/10 06:56 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions Unfortunately only a very occasional “lay” participant in hearings… #p2chat^09/28/10 06:58 PM ET

PublicDecisionsWld be good to collect input from others on best practices 4 public hearings this week we can share addl ideas at next wks’s #p2chat?^09/28/10 07:00 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions Good idea. Thanks for the #p2chat this evening.^09/28/10 07:02 PM ET

PublicDecisionsSee everybody next week! Suggestions for topics are always welcome 4 #p2chat feel free to DM me with any ideas^09/28/10 07:05 PM ET

This is the archive of tweets for the September 21 chat. (Archive courtesy of TwapperKeeper.)

PublicDecisionsHI everyone welcome to #P2Chat this week! Today’s topics include value results of civic engmt; connecting w existing conv online^09/21/10 05:46 PM ET

PublicDecisionsPlease introduce yourself! Name organization twitter handle a little about your work #P2Chat^09/21/10 05:54 PM ET

intelliticsMulti-tasking today but will try to keep an eye on #P2Chat as best I can (starts now!).^09/21/10 06:00 PM ET

PublicDecisionsBeth Offenbacker @PublicDecisions we use techn 2 share best pract ID emerging trends & showcase leading thinkers in #publicengmt #P2Chat^09/21/10 06:01 PM ET

citizentoolsChris Berendes – interested in understanding and communicating the ways in which civic engmt improves government and governance #p2chat^09/21/10 06:02 PM ET

PublicDecisionsjust a reminder pls join us/tweet 2 win Wendy Sarkissian’s CreativeCommPlanning bk More http://bit.ly/aSO8sJ #P2Chat^09/21/10 06:04 PM ET

PublicDecisionsLet’s start out by talking about value results of public engmt. What does “value” of public engmt mean to you ppl you work with? #P2Chat^09/21/10 06:05 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat ultimately civic engmt creates political will based on legitimacy visibility solid processes and follow-up^09/21/10 06:05 PM ET

PublicDecisionsCan also contribute to good mgmt of resources better stewardship on admin side; knit together comm id new resrces 4 solving probs #P2Chat^09/21/10 06:07 PM ET

PublicDecisionsWonder why “value” of p2 so hard to get ppl to accept tho? these all seem like solid things that ppl support #P2chat^09/21/10 06:09 PM ET

citizentools.@PublicDecisions #P2Chat by “new resources” do you mean smart citizens w/good ideas or something else?^09/21/10 06:11 PM ET

PublicDecisionscould be idea could also be $$ in kind support other ppl getting involved 2. More distrib power to address prblm than just govt #p2chat^09/21/10 06:12 PM ET

citizentools.@PublicDecisions #P2chat suggest it’s difficult for pols govts to be against civic engmt openly so it’s hard to have the conversation^09/21/10 06:13 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools I think dpnds on how you C engmtis it oppty to solve prob get indir visib4self meet/work w others some/allofthese? #p2chat^09/21/10 06:15 PM ET

PublicDecisionsI wld argue that good engmt req that self-int behavior take a much diminished role…public/community best interest shld be focus #P2chat^09/21/10 06:15 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGood resources on identifying value of engagement anyone can suggest? #p2chat^09/21/10 06:17 PM ET

PublicDecisions…or is value closely tied out outcomes?? #P2chat^09/21/10 06:20 PM ET

PublicDecisionssorry tied “TO” outcomes #p2chat^09/21/10 06:21 PM ET

citizentoolsAgreed that community interest should be focus; #p2chat experience is that sometimes civic engmt is last resort when things get stuck^09/21/10 06:21 PM ET

citizentoolsfor instance Ed Everett’s Redwood City water conservation project; @americaspeaks and the United New Orleans Plan #p2chat^09/21/10 06:22 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGood resources on measuring success in engagement http://www.involve.org.uk/evaluation-guide/success.shtml #P2chat^09/21/10 06:23 PM ET

intelliticsRT @PublicDecisions: Good resources on measuring success in engagement http://www.involve.org.uk/evaluation-guide/success.shtml #P2chat^09/21/10 06:23 PM ET

PublicDecisionstrue…all good examples.Perhaps we need wave of public mgrs to see engmt as strategy for eff day2day mgmt not just 4 hot potatoes? #P2chat^09/21/10 06:24 PM ET

transpartisanRT @PublicDecisions: Good resources on measuring success in engagement http://www.involve.org.uk/evaluation-guide/success.shtml #P2chat^09/21/10 06:25 PM ET

PublicDecisionsStudy from INVOLVE that they are doing that focuses on identifying values outcomes from engmt http://bit.ly/du2QHK #p2chat^09/21/10 06:26 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHave some other resources on outcomes I can share on blog (need to find links); watch for post at www.p2tools.blogspot.com #p2chat^09/21/10 06:28 PM ET

PublicDecisionstopic 2 tonight: What ways are ppl creating or finding conv online for engmt? going 2 existing places like FB or creating new? #P2chat^09/21/10 06:29 PM ET

PublicDecisionsInteresting article in FastCompany about negative aspects of using online env for disc http://bit.ly/97tD5d #P2Chat^09/21/10 06:31 PM ET

PublicDecisionsDid you know that 40% of Americans have a FB account although only 7% have Twitter acct? acc to recent Pew study #p2chat^09/21/10 06:33 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat @ncdd discussion on whether to GO to where the ppl are (online or off) or to BRING them into the discussion http://bit.ly/dw1RFR^09/21/10 06:34 PM ET

PublicDecisionsapps culture is interesting too 4 engmt..”35% of US adults have cell phones with apps but only 24% of adults actually use them” #p2chat^09/21/10 06:36 PM ET

PublicDecisions…data from Pew. Also “Apps users are younger more educated and more affluent than other cell phone users.”http://bit.ly/pFlIT #P2chat^09/21/10 06:37 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions so you end up going to both venues plus Mehante MySpace BlackPlanet etc. #p2chat^09/21/10 06:38 PM ET

PublicDecisionsintersting to consider…not all online env or technologies created equally in terms of reaching folks #p2chat^09/21/10 06:39 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions in that the different techs are a bit like languages – English not quite the one size that fits all. #p2chat^09/21/10 06:40 PM ET

poetspiritI always send engmt news to where the people that might be interested are- twitter & facebook; may try linkdin #p2chat^09/21/10 06:40 PM ET

PublicDecisionsNew Pew study: Afr Am & Latinos on internet don’t just use soc web at higher rates attitudes to tools differ 2 http://bit.ly/cxF5I6 #p2chat^09/21/10 06:41 PM ET

citizentools.@poetspirit #p2chat what tools do you use to identify where ppl that might be interested are or might be?^09/21/10 06:43 PM ET

poetspiritFor practitioners and others interested in engmt I just added a simple chat room to www.allthingsreform.org #p2chat^09/21/10 06:43 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools So true! David Friedman on webinar last wk said we build & expect ppl will just come…need 2actively engage 4 success #p2chat^09/21/10 06:45 PM ET

PublicDecisions…cannot be passive need to ask for ppl to share expertise info they have in very active way…relationships and ties are impt #p2chat^09/21/10 06:46 PM ET

PublicDecisionsThanks @poetspirit! Wld love your insignts on enging w ppl how to id where they particip8 online…do survey?other ways?? #p2chat^09/21/10 06:46 PM ET

poetspiritI try to follow or friend people interested in the field and send news to them. RT @citizentools: .@poetspirit #p2chat what tools… ?^09/21/10 06:47 PM ET

citizentools@poetspirit Makes sense. LIstening is more observed in theory than practice. #p2chat^09/21/10 06:49 PM ET

poetspiritI’d like to better use Twitter Lists and associated apps for finding more people interested in the practice #p2chat^09/21/10 06:49 PM ET

PublicDecisionsI use some twitter lists seems easier to use than FB or Linked In (IMHO) #P2chat^09/21/10 06:52 PM ET

citizentoolsI’m learning that the #socmed pros who actually listen do so episodically. Nobody reads their 3k Twitter friends #p2chat^09/21/10 06:54 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat Instead they use #socmed search tools http://bit.ly/9SVroA or they have Twitter lists they dip into for particular issues^09/21/10 06:56 PM ET

PublicDecisionsgood pt @citizentools…tho I findTwitteruseful for scanning 4 trends insights…easier than scrolling thru dozens of FBpages(4me) #p2chat^09/21/10 06:57 PM ET

poetspiritI think we should bring together the different sub-topics of engmt including #gov20 #p2chat^09/21/10 06:58 PM ET

PublicDecisionsYes search tools are gr8 I have some set up too. Being a good public engmt practitioner req more techn orientation 2day! #p2chat^09/21/10 06:59 PM ET

citizentoolsSearch is big. Heard yesterday for instance that oaklandlocal.com uses FB search 2 gather info to repub (/wpermission) to its blog #p2chat^09/21/10 06:59 PM ET

PublicDecisions@poetspirit are there specific aspects of 2.0 and engmt you would like to see us discuss 2gether? #gov20 #p2chat^09/21/10 07:00 PM ET

citizentools@poetspirit about out of time but good idea; how wld you start on this? #gov20 #p2chat^09/21/10 07:01 PM ET

poetspirit@citizentools Having been very close to the goings on of gov20 and more recently engmt I’ve been sending news on engmt to #gov20 #p2chat^09/21/10 07:01 PM ET

PublicDecisions@poetspirit wld be gr8 to hr more on how we could collab in this way #p2chat^09/21/10 07:01 PM ET

citizentools@poetspirit I’ll check out your tweets and blog. #gov20 #p2chat^09/21/10 07:05 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHave 2 head out for anniv dinner Gr8 conv this wk @citizentools & @poetspirit! Many thanks 4 RTs @intellitics @transpartisan! #p2chat^09/21/10 07:07 PM ET

poetspiritThank you; is this chat weekly or more often? #p2chat^09/21/10 07:08 PM ET

citizentoolsThanks everyone. @PublicDecisions always has the best after-chat plans. We should hold a contest #p2chat^09/21/10 07:08 PM ET

PublicDecisions@poetspirit we meet weekly it’d be fantastic to have you join us next week (Tues 6p Eastern 3p Pacific) #p2chat^09/21/10 07:09 PM ET

PublicDecisionsthanks @citizentools! Looking forward to next week’s discussion; have a great week everyone! #p2chat^09/21/10 07:10 PM ET

poetspiritI look forward to it; have more ideas on getting broader use of engmt in politics elsewhere #p2chat^09/21/10 07:11 PM ET

poetspiritPublicDecisions: #P2Chat- chat on Twitter every Tues from 6-7pm ET (22:00 GMT)  http://bit.ly/clqVal #gov20 #opengov #activism^09/21/10 07:12 PM ET

This is the archive of tweets for the September 14 chat. (Archive courtesy of TwapperKeeper.)

PublicDecisionsHi everyone and welcome to this week’s #P2Chat! This week we’ll be talking about Web 2.0 mobile phones & civic engmt &other gr8 stuff too^09/14/10 05:30 PM ET

PublicDecisionsPlease introduce yourself and tell us about the work you do #P2Chat^09/14/10 05:34 PM ET

PublicDecisionsI’m Beth Offenbacker @PublicDecisions We use techn 2 enhance public engmt thru our distinctive online programs conf and training #P2chat^09/14/10 05:59 PM ET

PublicDecisionsNew report out about use of mobile phones and civic engmt shows link betwn usage http://bit.ly/c3FjLu #P2Chat^09/14/10 05:59 PM ET

citizentoolsChris Berendes Netalyst CTO Gov2.0 in the ’90s w/the Reinventing Gov’t team and Nuclear Reg Comm in the ’00s with USDOT; #p2chat blogger^09/14/10 06:02 PM ET

PublicDecisionsMobile ph pt2/findings: "techn for info exch & recreation R positive predictors of participation in civic life" http://bit.ly/c3FjLu #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:05 PM ET

PublicDecisions….HOWEVER link is "moderated by mobile communication competence" #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:06 PM ET

PublicDecisionsQ: to what degree are you using mobile techn as part of #publicengmt efforts? Little some a lot none?? #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:07 PM ET

citizentoolsRT @PublicDecisions: New report out about use of mobile phones and civic engmt shows link betwn usage http://bit.ly/c3FjLu #p2chat^09/14/10 06:07 PM ET

citizentoolsHow much longer will mobile be an entirely separate category vs. a "flavor" as say Mac vs. PC have been for a while? #p2chat^09/14/10 06:08 PM ET

citizentoolsBeth – any surprising to you about the study? #p2chat^09/14/10 06:09 PM ET

PublicDecisionsSeveral fed agencies like EPA DOT are adapting websites so can be used/seen on smartphones pdas; not seeing so much by state/local #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:10 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Agree more and more blurring; Pew report this wk saying that 60% ppl use mobiles to go on internet send text email #p2chat^09/14/10 06:11 PM ET

PublicDecisionsOOPs correction….Pew said 40% (not 60%) is up 8% since last yr #p2chat^09/14/10 06:12 PM ET

PublicDecisionsU Mich study interesting to see assn talked about a new kind of ‘digital divide’ in this way #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:14 PM ET

PublicDecisions@CItIzentools my pers exp has been more broad appr 2 engage ppl less segmenting of grps acc 2 techn; your exp too? Seeing shift tho #P2chat^09/14/10 06:14 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions how many engagement sponsors/consultants attempt to engage in all the different aves avail? would be eye-opening. #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:15 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions matters also whether a particular tech meant to cre8 more access to same ppl already on web or bring in new ppl #P2chat^09/14/10 06:17 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Agree would be fascinating data; also how to choose among many choices why some chosen over others #P2chat^09/14/10 06:18 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Agree would be fascinating data; also how to choose among many choices why some chosen over others #P2chat^09/14/10 06:19 PM ET

PublicDecisionsNew data re cities using soc media 4 #publicengmt (Shameless plug: NLC folks spking at free pgm in Oct for us) http://bit.ly/afotJ4 #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:19 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat interesting take on mobile as way to reach the "too digital too busy" i.e. execs http://bit.ly/awgaXo^09/14/10 06:19 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Great piece on engaging senior folks think gen assumption is mobile is not for them… #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:22 PM ET

PublicDecisionsWhat influence is iPad having on sr execs &on comm too? Seeing more ppl using (anecdotally)…I think of iPad as "souped up" smartph #P2chat^09/14/10 06:22 PM ET

citizentoolsSeem to be a lot of IPad converts. FlipBoard app http://bit.ly/ac0SI6 converts your followers/friends into new editors #p2chat^09/14/10 06:23 PM ET

PublicDecisionsFollow on to last week’s #crowdsourcing disc have you been following Challenge.gov news? http://bit.ly/9Ahgjr #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:25 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHaven’t seen prize money as part of p2 efforts before; new to others too?? #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:29 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions I think $$$ prizes for p2 tricky; wise man said "you can send flowers after a date but not the $$$ equiv" #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:29 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions I think $$$ prizes for p2 tricky; wise man said “you can send flowers after a date but not the $$$ equiv” #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:30 PM ET

PublicDecisionsQuestion is about whether influence of possibly getting actual reward vs karmic one is good or not so good… #P2chat^09/14/10 06:34 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions More seriously – nature of prize important – appreciation "insider status" probably works better than $$$ for p2 #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:34 PM ET

PublicDecisions@Citizentools Agreealso worry that competition rather than coop collab is emphasized #P2chat^09/14/10 06:34 PM ET

citizentoolsIpad again – convert at Forrester: "The iPad gives me an omnipresent window into that digital world. " http://bit.ly/9EtzwW #p2chat^09/14/10 06:35 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGood stories coming out of Gov 2.0 summit did you see one on legal challenges of FB other apps http://bit.ly/aZZ5iK #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:36 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions re coop v collab – prize may spur selective collab if entries must meet a high standard e.g. #netflix prize #P2chat^09/14/10 06:37 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions re coop v collab – prize may spur selective collab if entries must meet a high standard e.g. #netflix prize #P2chat^09/14/10 06:39 PM ET

PublicDecisions@Citizentools would love to have iPad myself much lighter than laptop (or even Netbook) #P2chat^09/14/10 06:39 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions key line: ‚ÄúI have to somehow make it work but it takes a bit of doing‚Äù +10 That’s a #gov20 -savvycounsel. #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:39 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions key line: ‚ÄúI have to somehow make it work but it takes a bit of doing‚Äù +10 That’s a #gov20 -savvycounsel. #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:39 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Good point on collab and standards #Netflix prob gold standard in prompting that #P2chat^09/14/10 06:41 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions Imagine value of iconizing a p2 "weather rpt" to fit in corner of Ipad screen #P2chat^09/14/10 06:41 PM ET

citizentoolsRT @PublicDecisions: Follow on to last week’s #crowdsourcing disc have you been following Challenge.gov news? http://bit.ly/9Ahgjr #p2chat^09/14/10 06:42 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools So easy to get caught up using tools we already kno not new ones too…have 2 use tools that ppl we want 2 reach use #P2chat^09/14/10 06:42 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat Compare NLC http://bit.ly/czwsW8 vs. commercial #socmed http://bit.ly/akHcsm <grump>Which has gone from novelty to value?</grump>^09/14/10 06:43 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHad a genl sense that UK ahead of US in govt digi media report based on 20 govt depts says ‘not really’ http://bit.ly/cqRSrT #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:45 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHad a genl sense that UK ahead of US in govt digi media report based on 20 govt depts says ‘not really’ http://bit.ly/cqRSrT #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:46 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Say more about…do u mean priv sector ‘gets it’ more?? #p2chat #socmed^09/14/10 06:48 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Say more about…do u mean priv sector ‘gets it’ more?? #p2chat #socmed^09/14/10 06:48 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions "conversation"and "two-way" and "interactive" conspicuously absent on that p. ;-( #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:49 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Interesting obs…that squares w UK report too..more use for info starting 2 get into soc med 4 engmt #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:49 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Interesting obs…that squares w UK report too..more use for info starting 2 get into soc med 4 engmt #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:50 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions yup. Private sector more focused on outcomes e.g. sales. Govt in gen’l more in the "hey I tweeted" stage #p2chat #socmed^09/14/10 06:51 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions <grump>countless presentations that start w/30 s on "mkts = conversations" then 30m on "how to push messages" #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:51 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions <grump>countless presentations that start w/30 s on “mkts = conversations” then 30m on “how to push messages” #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:52 PM ET

PublicDecisionsSome gr8 examples though of how nonprofits are harnessing soc med for engmt action http://www.comminit.com/en/node/322585/306# #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:53 PM ET

PublicDecisionsSome gr8 examples though of how nonprofits are harnessing soc med for engmt action http://www.comminit.com/en/node/322585/306# #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:53 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions also interesting that most #gov20 friends unfamiliar with http://amzn.to/bgcrFh or @charleneli #p2chat #socmed^09/14/10 06:54 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Yes some orgs think of p2 and marketing together when (I thnk) shld be abt serving public interest #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:54 PM ET

citizentoolsRT @PublicDecisions: Some gr8 examples though of how nonprofits are harnessing soc med for engmt action http://www.comminit.com/en/node/322585/306# #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:55 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGreat conversation this week as always! this is like a high-octane version of chatting around the watercooler #p2chat^09/14/10 06:56 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions Also think that listening is hard and humbling but can lead to highly effective marketing (hence the biz interest) #P2Chat^09/14/10 06:56 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions Big fun – great linksthanks. Still working on that 58pp report though #p2chat^09/14/10 06:58 PM ET

PublicDecisions@Citizentools you are right on about listening…so easy to talk much more work to listen actively #p2chat^09/14/10 06:59 PM ET

PublicDecisionsThanks @Citizentools! Have a great evening and looking forward to the conversation next week! #P2chat^09/14/10 07:00 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions Thanks for hosting Beth. #p2chat^09/14/10 07:00 PM ET

This is the archive of tweets for the September 7 chat.

PublicDecisionsHowdy folks! Welcome to #P2Chat for Tues Sept 7. Today’s topics are #crowdsourcing & handling comments. Let’s get started!^09/07/10 05:30 PM ET

PublicDecisionsPlease introduce yourself…be sure to use #P2Chat when posting so others can see your posts (and we can archive it too)^09/07/10 05:46 PM ET

PublicDecisionsBeth Offenbacker @PublicDecisions We use technology to enhance public engmt through our distinctive online pgms confs & training #P2Chat^09/07/10 05:59 PM ET

intelliticsIntroductions for #P2Chat: Intellitics is a participation startup based in San José CA. We develop @zilino.^09/07/10 06:00 PM ET

citizentoolsChris Berendes Netalyst CTO dealt w/comment flood as USDOT CRM team lead after 9/11 If only we’d had ideascale etc. back then… #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:02 PM ET

PublicDecisionsQuick poll: how many folks here have had experience with crowdsourcing vs. are checking it out? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:02 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions Been watching the intersection btwn crowdsourcing and public participation for a while now. #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:04 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHave one proj in past (didn’t call it crowdsrcing tho) and have small new one now #p2Chat^09/07/10 06:06 PM ET

PublicDecisionsThanks @2ndOpinionLive sounds like gr8resource! "Our users hve bn enjoying "personal crowdsourcing" via Second Opinion iPhone app" #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:08 PM ET

citizentoolsMostly “checking out” I’ve confronted the general question of “here’s 1000 comments. now what?” more than once. #p2chat^09/07/10 06:10 PM ET

PublicDecisionspt 2…my experience in past didn’t use all cool crowdsourcing tools now avail…very impressive array that’s blossomed lately! #P2chat^09/07/10 06:10 PM ET

citizentoolsRT @2ndOpinionLive: @PublicDecisions Our users have been enjoying “personal crowdsourcing” via the Second Opinion iPhone app #p2chat^09/07/10 06:11 PM ET

ccfkcIntro for #P2Chat. CCF is a civic engagement nonprofit in King County WA. Existed primarily offline & building a new online program^09/07/10 06:11 PM ET

PublicDecisionsMaybe good place 2 start is how to build crowdsourcing into overall p2 approach? decision criteria to use w comments etc? #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:12 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHi @ccfkc! Welcome to #P2Chat ^09/07/10 06:13 PM ET

intelliticsThe term “crowdsourcing” is often applied incorrectly. Helps to get clear on definitions every once in a while: http://bit.ly/aNfwSP #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:14 PM ET

PublicDecisions…what is promise to the public (@IAp2 spectrum) for comments via crowdsourcing?? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:15 PM ET

citizentoolsSuggest how ppl offer input is imprtnt distinctn – in wikip crowdsource (cs) via edits; in Mech TUrk cs via all sorts of actions #p2chat^09/07/10 06:17 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGr8 post @intellitics…do you think that the term has evolved in recent months w growth in tools from what originally written?? #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:17 PM ET

citizentools@intellitics so for #crowdsource single input generally not that imported or respected – it’s one of 100′s or 1000′s #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:18 PM ET

PublicDecisions@ccfkc wld be interested in hearing about your online comm do you use crowdsourcing or considering? #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:20 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions That’s often the problem! Opening up the comment/idea box but no concept how input should/can/will be used. #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:21 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools makes me also think of who has control…does public have final say (Empower) or sponsor (Inform)? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:21 PM ET

citizentools@ccfkc Hey welcome! what’s your interest experience in #crowdsourcing? #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:22 PM ET

transprVery good! RT @intellitics: The term “crowdsourcing” needs definition every once in a while: http://bit.ly/aNfwSP #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:22 PM ET

citizentools@intellitics I regret now suggesting that comments=crowdsourcing. #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:23 PM ET

citizentools@intellitics Power of crowdsourcing is that it *is* action (e.g. wiki edit photo tag) that doesn’t require further processing #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:23 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHave not seen alotof postcrowdsourcing reports after …what was heard decided why etc.? Any good ex out there folks can point 2? #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:23 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions The definition is pretty clear not sure it should change. The term’s definitely being overused in my view. #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:24 PM ET

PublicDecisionsI C distinction btwn Wiki edit vs spons site like Ideascale etc tho/Crowd may offer input govt usually has final say #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:25 PM ET

PublicDecisionsExample of using crowdsourcing for ideas suggestions http://bit.ly/4FdJKZ #p2chat^09/07/10 06:25 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions so in some cs projs “boiling down” is intrinsic (e.g. wiki edits); in others it happens later if at all #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:28 PM ET

PublicDecisionsNew fed crowdsourcing project Challenge.gov to launch in next few weeks for exploration and innovation http://bit.ly/9Lr40M #p2chat^09/07/10 06:29 PM ET

citizentools@transpr Welcome – join the chat. What’s your #crowdsourcing interest experience? #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:31 PM ET

PublicDecisionsQ: how are crowdsourcing efforts differnt than comments submitted electr under fed rulemaking? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:31 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHi @transpr! welcome to the #p2chat discussion!^09/07/10 06:31 PM ET

intelliticsGreat #crowdsourcing flow chart by @nraford. Policy making/public participation doesn’t always seem to fit in: http://bit.ly/cyiZYn #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:32 PM ET

PublicDecisionsperhaps comments do not hve commitment for public to vote on?? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:33 PM ET

transpartisanCommenting & brainstorming are not same as “crowdsourcing” BUT they are components of it. So its easy for ppl to get confused. #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:33 PM ET

citizentoolsRT @ccfkc: @PublicDecisions We currently use survey tool to quantify results & working on new ways to capture qualitative responses #p2chat^09/07/10 06:34 PM ET

citizentoolsRT @ccfkc: The main thing we use #crowdsourcing for is to identify key issues for local policy-makers //#p2chat^09/07/10 06:35 PM ET

PublicDecisionsSeveral posts/resources from @DelibThinks on crowdsourcing http://bit.ly/br1vDl #p2chat^09/07/10 06:35 PM ET

transpr@citizentools @PublicDecisions Thx for the welcome! Been wanting to join in! Do PR/PI for gov clients. #p2chat^09/07/10 06:36 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHi @transpartisan welcome to #P2Chat!^09/07/10 06:36 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions say more about “commitment to voice on” … #p2chat^09/07/10 06:36 PM ET

transprThink more and more gov is going to utilize #crowdsourcing but like social media term may scare many #p2chat^09/07/10 06:37 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools wonder how many orgs commit 2 how will use/consider data fr csourcing in dec mking? agree w @transpr may b exception #p2chat^09/07/10 06:37 PM ET

PublicDecisionssee two types of csourcing themes here…data citizens create selves/modify vote on control vs that submitted 4 others 2 consider #p2chat^09/07/10 06:38 PM ET

intelliticsReporting graffiti/potholes is a great #crowdsourcing opportunity. Deciding how to allocate scarce budget resources not so much. #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:39 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGood story here in Guardian (UK) about govt challengs of csourcing…noting failures of http://bit.ly/crp4uh #p2chat^09/07/10 06:41 PM ET

transpartisan@PublicDecisions – Federal rulemaking is crowdsourcing. In both cases Commenting does the same thing. #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:42 PM ET

PublicDecisionsAny good metrics anyone can suggest for csourcing?? use soc media metrics or others?? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:42 PM ET

citizentools@transpartisan Welcome Steve. What do you think is required to call a process “crowdsourcing”? #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:42 PM ET

transpr1st challenge is buy in 2nd is to get funds toward it. RT @PublicDecisions: @citizentools … agree w @transpr may b exception #p2chat^09/07/10 06:42 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat leaning away from calling regulatory comments “crowdsourcing”. To me essence of cs is that an individual contrib is not important.^09/07/10 06:43 PM ET

PublicDecisionsTwo other resources from @DelibThinks http://bit.ly/aji7kL also Dialogue App (http://bit.ly/aJrPMC / http://bit.ly/djfuD7 #p2chat^09/07/10 06:43 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions Except… “Programme for Government” was not a #crowdsourcing exercise. The Guardian mislabeled that one big time. #P2chat^09/07/10 06:45 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat e.g. wikipedia under no obligation to preserve my edit; Mechanical Turk customer need not accept my bit of work^09/07/10 06:45 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions re metrics: first did the task get done (the LoC photos labeled? the potholes found?) #p2chat^09/07/10 06:46 PM ET

intelliticsMy latest post tries to clarify (I’ve written about that project several times): http://bit.ly/ci19va #P2Chat #edem^09/07/10 06:46 PM ET

PublicDecisionsother csourcing info sent in 2day…from @ascentum “Crowdsourcing: 5 Reasons Why It‚Äôs Here to Stay” http://bit.ly/aPyRXx #p2chat^09/07/10 06:47 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools maybe also metric…(like soc media) visitors vs unique visitors…and participation rate among them #p2chat^09/07/10 06:48 PM ET

intelliticsRT @twipcast: FYI two of our five pilot episodes focused on #crowdsourcing: http://bit.ly/a4Q3EG #P2Chat #edem #gov20^09/07/10 06:48 PM ET

transprRT @PublicDecisions: from @ascentum ” #Crowdsourcing: 5 Reasons Why It‚Äôs Here to Stay” http://bit.ly/aPyRXx #p2chat #opengov #gov20^09/07/10 06:50 PM ET

transpartisan@intellitics cited the definition of the word’s originator. But where does it say that it’s only for small problems (eg potholes)? #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:50 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHow diverse is crowdsourcing…in democracy are only ppl with latest/coolest toys posting?? any data anyone’s seen? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:50 PM ET

PublicDecisions@transpartisan maybe definition of csourcing is in transition? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:51 PM ET

citizentools@transpartisan of course some potholes in DC (and of course Boston as well) as hardly “small” #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:51 PM ET

intellitics@transpartisan #Crowdsourcing can be applied to massive problems/challenges (e.g. Netflix Prize) key is to understand what kind. #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:53 PM ET

transpr@PublicDecisions I think #crowdsourcing like #socialmedia other #PR tools is one tool to use in outreach strategy. #p2chat^09/07/10 06:53 PM ET

PublicDecisionsR local govts using crowdsourcing to same degree as fed? how about state govts? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:54 PM ET

transprDfinitions meaningless? More abt what needed 4 specific effort. RT @PublicDecisions: @transpartisan definition in transition? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:54 PM ET

athenabridgeWith new tools government crowdsourcing efforts may eventually evolve far beyond comments/ideas and toward conversation/dialogue. #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:55 PM ET

transprVery few in both cases. Still catching up w/ social media. RT @PublicDecisions: R local govts? how about state govts? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:56 PM ET

intelliticsBeen trying to work out the key items to consider before using #crowdsourcing in #publicengmt: http://bit.ly/8zYfU0 #P2Chat #edem^09/07/10 06:56 PM ET

PublicDecisions@transpr would csourcing also be type of socmed? see gray areas there I guess; agree/disagr? @ccfkc does that square w yr exp too? #p2chat^09/07/10 06:57 PM ET

transprListening now! Good! RT @intellitics: RT @twipcast: audio on #crowdsourcing: http://bit.ly/a4Q3EG #P2Chat #edem #gov20^09/07/10 06:58 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHi @athenabridge welcome to #p2chat!^09/07/10 06:58 PM ET

ccfkc@PublicDecisions The City of Seattle http://bit.ly/dl20QD and Washington State http://bit.ly/cDJkeN are both using #crowdsourcing #P2Chat^09/07/10 06:58 PM ET

citizentoolsI want to sound the @intellitics note here: it turns out that there are web-based processes that aren’t crowdsourcing … #p2chat^09/07/10 06:59 PM ET

PublicDecisionsTime flies…! fantastic discussion tonight!! suggestions for next week? more on csourcing comments or new topic?? #p2chat^09/07/10 07:00 PM ET

transpartisan@intellitics – Where does the definition of “crowdsourcing” limit itself on the range of problems that it might solve? #P2Chat^09/07/10 07:00 PM ET

transpr@PublicDecisions I believe strongly it’s all meshing and tools now allow tailored use to fit needs of project. #p2chat^09/07/10 07:01 PM ET

citizentools@intellitics what I like in this post: crowdsourcing does not require representativeness or stakeholders. +1 #p2chat^09/07/10 07:02 PM ET

PublicDecisions@ccfkc have not seen these…thanks 4 sending. Great examples of local govt leading way! #p2chat^09/07/10 07:02 PM ET

intelliticsGreat you guys join the #P2Chat today: @transpartisan @transpr @athenabridge @ccfkc (also @ascentum and @DelibThinks via time warp). ^09/07/10 07:02 PM ET

intelliticsRT @citizentools: @intellitics what I like in this post: crowdsourcing does not require representativeness or stakeholders. +1 #p2chat^09/07/10 07:02 PM ET

PublicDecisions@ccfkc oops also state level too #p2chat^09/07/10 07:03 PM ET

transprHad fun! Thanks for the kind welcome #p2chat and @citizentools @intellitics @PublicDecisions^09/07/10 07:04 PM ET

PublicDecisionsSee y’all next week! many thanks 2 @intellitics @transpartisan @citizentools @athenabridge @transpr @ccfkc 4 participating! #p2chat^09/07/10 07:04 PM ET

PublicDecisionsRT @intellitics: Great #crowdsourcing flow chart by @nraford. Policy making/public participation doesn’t always seem to fit in: http://bit.ly/cyiZYn #P2Chat^09/07/10 07:05 PM ET

ccfkcThanks @PublicDecisions @citizentools & @intellics! Looking forward to next week’s #P2Chat^09/07/10 07:07 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions Ditto to all. Thanks. See ya. #p2chat^09/07/10 07:13 PM ET

ccfkcThanks @PublicDecisions @citizentools & @intellitics! Looking forward to next week’s #P2Chat^09/07/10 07:14 PM ET

JohnFMooreRT @transpr: Listening now! Good! RT @intellitics: RT @twipcast: audio on #crowdsourcing: http://bit.ly/a4Q3EG #P2Chat #edem #gov20^09/07/10 07:15 PM ET

This is the archive of tweets for the August 31 chat.

PublicDecisionsHi everyone welcome to this week’s #P2Chat! We have a lot of great things to talk about regarding #publicengmt^08/25/10 11:08 AM ET

PublicDecisionsPlease introduce yourself for this week’s #P2Chat….name Twitter handle a little about you/your org^08/31/10 05:36 PM ET

PublicDecisionsBeth Offenbacker #P2Chat co-moderator with @Citizentools. @PublicDecisions: we use techn 2 enhance publicengmt thru distinctive online pgms^08/31/10 06:00 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat intro: Chris Berendes blogger local acitivist CTO for a fed contractor; interested in lessons learned about online engagement^08/31/10 06:00 PM ET

PublicDecisionsLast week we talked some about online and f2f engmt as part of #p2chat; let’s build on that gr8 thread by starting there^08/31/10 06:03 PM ET

PublicDecisionsPew Survey on older ple’s uses 4 Soc Med http://bit.ly/cBqFk2 Q: does yr org distinguish btwn diff demog in re social media strat? #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:04 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Very true… we forget need to integrate the two into tool selection use #p2chat^08/31/10 06:07 PM ET

PublicDecisionsMy own observ is most orgs don’t distinguish betw demogaltho we prob shld. cld make engmt more effective. Will try to implem myself #p2chat^08/31/10 06:10 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions @zephoria pt: *how* a demographic uses a tool; e.g. young ppl disclose on #fb what I suspect elders don’t #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:13 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions examples of where not distinguishing has caused trouble? #p2chat^08/31/10 06:15 PM ET

PublicDecisionsdon’t have gd exmpl myslf. Think it has alot to do with what commty participants expect from engmt maybe? Needs/interests may vary #p2chat^08/31/10 06:16 PM ET

intelliticsJoining #P2Chat a bit late today. Howdy! ^08/31/10 06:17 PM ET

citizentools@intellitics hey. congrats on the wide play the “10 tips for online/offline” got #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:20 PM ET

PublicDecisions@Citizentools not so much prblmmore realiz “one size” doesn’t fit all…need 2 custmze online apprch on needs/int as w other meth #p2chat^08/31/10 06:24 PM ET

PublicDecisionsHey @intellitics! Always glad to connect w you #p2chat^08/31/10 06:26 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools @intellitics Have you seen need 4 diff in demog appr to soc med? (Is it just me surmising based on Pew report??) #p2chat^08/31/10 06:26 PM ET

PublicDecisions@Intellitics any word on the SXSW proposal? I voted for it can ppl still support? #p2chat^08/31/10 06:27 PM ET

intellitics@citizentools Thanks! @democracy just added a few more items in the comments. Good stuff! #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:28 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions Voting for #SXSW Panel Picker has ended. We’ll see how it goes. It’s a bit of a long shot. #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:29 PM ET

citizentools@intellitics since this is pretty intimate I’ll float an idea to extend participatedb #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:29 PM ET

citizentoolswhat if: get list from iap2 practitioners of favored in practice (or wished for) online processes; = use cases #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:31 PM ET

citizentoolsthen ask tool providers (w/some help) to self select for use cases they can handle and do short (5min) video demos ?#p2chat^08/31/10 06:35 PM ET

citizentoolsresults: non-techie get a better idea of how various tools work for processes they understand #p2chat^08/31/10 06:36 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools very cool idea…existing vs. desired. cld be quite fascinating 2 track #p2chat^08/31/10 06:36 PM ET

citizentoolsAND toolsmiths get better sense of demand and how to present their coooool tools #p2chat^08/31/10 06:37 PM ET

intellitics@citizentools Good! I was thinking about prototyping a “tool selection wizard” for the upcoming @NCDD Fall events. #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:37 PM ET

intellitics@citizentools That sounds interesting! From what I’m seeing uptake of “online” still very mixed early days etc. #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:38 PM ET

citizentools@intellitics shall we talk offline? #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:38 PM ET

PublicDecisions@intellitics will there be sort/search feature soon on participatedb? #p2chat^08/31/10 06:40 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat and for my next question: what have you/we learned as participants or organizers of online engagement?^08/31/10 06:41 PM ET

PublicDecisions4 me it’s that the idea of online engmt still new to some folks…esp in areas with dialup internet #p2Chat^08/31/10 06:41 PM ET

citizentoolsone long term lesson: exponential growth means that there are a lot of newbies #p2Chat^08/31/10 06:41 PM ET

PublicDecisionsearly adopters are into not evryone is tho. Ex:fam mem has tvdish in rural county NO email thru DSL cable etc. email at work tho #p2chat^08/31/10 06:43 PM ET

PublicDecisions…also means NO internet access #p2chat^08/31/10 06:45 PM ET

citizentoolsone reason why @democracy emphasizes email/web equal opp’ty for his dialog tool #p2chat^08/31/10 06:46 PM ET

citizentoolsa lesson as a participant: I can generally make myself heard (=loudmouth) offline; not always online #p2chat^08/31/10 06:46 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Yes easy for us urban dwellers who are connected 24/7 to think all others are too.Smtimes internet just not avail #p2chat^08/31/10 06:48 PM ET

PublicDecisionsValue of mix of apprches impt; am wking on proj incl in person online as well as teleph mtgs and hosted mtgs 2 (proj in rural area) #p2chat^08/31/10 06:49 PM ET

PublicDecisionsLesson 4 me as participant: practicing active listening hard to do may be harder when I am not being neutral facil #p2chat^08/31/10 06:49 PM ET

PublicDecisionsOnline active listening takes on very diff dynamic naturally…how to listen *btwn* words meaning like at in person mtg?? #p2chat^08/31/10 06:51 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions “active listening” harder when online? (for me probably since many screens open etc.) #p2chat^08/31/10 06:54 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Yes since we can’t always “hear” the meaning have to ponder more what is meant…value of emoticons tho! #p2chat^08/31/10 06:55 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions may listening online happens more slowly – offline you can learn a lot in 60 sec; maybe online takes longer #p2chat^08/31/10 06:55 PM ET

citizentools@intellitics any lessons learned as online engagement participant or organizer (or developer)? #p2chat^08/31/10 06:57 PM ET

PublicDecisionsThanks 4 gr8 disc as always @citizentools @intellitics! Have a fantastic Labor Day wknd and see everybody next week! #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:58 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions @intellitics over and out. let’s ponder our recruitment options a bit for next week. Perhaps a prize? #P2Chat^08/31/10 06:59 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions @citizentools Nice chattin’ #P2Chat^08/31/10 07:05 PM ET

This is the archive of tweets for the August 24 chat.

PublicDecisionsWelcome to this week’s #p2chat for Tues Aug 24 2010! Please post a brief intro of yourself (and remember to include #p2chat when posting)^08/24/10 05:58 PM ET

PublicDecisionsYou can also follow the discussion for this week’s #p2chat at http://bit.ly/dg46nu^08/24/10 05:58 PM ET

citizentoolsChris Berendes #gov20 advocate blogger on online engagement etc. looking forward to this week’s #p2chat^08/24/10 05:59 PM ET

PublicDecisionsBeth Offenbacker @PublicDecisions We use techn 2 improve practice of engaging people thru distinctive online conf pgms & classes #p2chat^08/24/10 06:00 PM ET

PublicDecisionsSpecial thanks to Chris Berendes @citizentools who has kindly agreed to co-moderate #p2chat; he also archives our chats too ^08/24/10 06:01 PM ET

PublicDecisionsToday’s subject is f2f and online engmt how to best integr8? Pointers suggestions etc. #p2chat (courtesy of @intellitics)^08/24/10 06:02 PM ET

intelliticsWe’re a participation startup from San Jos√© CA. We’re developing @zilino a new web app for online consultations. #P2Chat #opengov #edem^08/24/10 06:04 PM ET

PublicDecisionsOther topics welcome too! What questions subjects do you have about public engmt? #p2chat^08/24/10 06:06 PM ET

citizentoolsSo of @intellitics ‘s post on integration of on/offline engagement http://bit.ly/99Gbe3 I liked 345 – bridge back and forth #p2chat^08/24/10 06:06 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGood ex of comparison I came across (by accident) earlier today see http://www.cihr.gc.ca/e/42214.html (scroll down to App 2) #p2chat^08/24/10 06:06 PM ET

PublicDecisionsDon’t know much about how structured from p2 planning persp although wrote about another example on blog http://bit.ly/dmUtRN #p2chat^08/24/10 06:07 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions Great find! I’ll have to dig up the articles I’ve read on this issue (our wiki let me down last night). #P2Chat^08/24/10 06:09 PM ET

PublicDecisionsWhy do most orgs struggle with integration? Many seem to be wary of negative posts even with moderation; easier to control in f2f #p2chat^08/24/10 06:11 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat – what are some examples of struggling wit h integration?^08/24/10 06:13 PM ET

PublicDecisions@intellitics @citizentools Do you find that most orgs are on board with true integr? nonprof I am wking with likes which is good #p2chat^08/24/10 06:13 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools #p2chat I would say having limited ability 4 people to say what they feel needs to be said in online env too many "controls"^08/24/10 06:15 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat agree somewhat on controls but that’s more a prob w/online per se than "integration"^08/24/10 06:16 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat what strikes me about the App2 list is that w/online we don’t know who is ‘in the room" or who will see it later == unsafe^08/24/10 06:17 PM ET

citizentools.@intellitics you still in the #p2chat?^08/24/10 06:19 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools ok good pt on controls I guess I C balance in those instnces tipping more 2 f2f so then less emph placed on online #p2chat^08/24/10 06:19 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions The integration issue arose from @NCDD. Seems many practitioners are just starting to wrap their heads around this. #P2Chat^08/24/10 06:22 PM ET

PublicDecisionsso less emphasis means less integration; which raises Q what proportion of integration is gen the case betw f2f and online #p2chat^08/24/10 06:22 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat re @intellitics online/offline 28: why? say we had split f2f mtg betw. 2 breakouts: would we insist everyone spend time in both?^08/24/10 06:23 PM ET

PublicDecisionsWould love to see examples of good/bad integr. Can learn from both #p2chat^08/24/10 06:23 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools yes you are right about who is "in the room" how do orgs address this? Some req sign in from what I have seen/heard #p2chat^08/24/10 06:24 PM ET

intellitics@citizentools I think getting (some portion of) participants to engage both online and off could be very beneficial yes. #P2Chat^08/24/10 06:25 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat obviously I’m grumpy abt integration. Rather start w/ say "participant in either mode/brkout room has equal access to engmt proces"^08/24/10 06:27 PM ET

citizentools.@intellitics #P2Chat granted on 345; beyond that what’s benefit of offliners ALSO going online?^08/24/10 06:27 PM ET

PublicDecisionsAm thinking back to p2 planning disc p2 plan 4 proj should focus on goals 1st. Is there good chart showing online tool match 2 goal?#p2chat^08/24/10 06:27 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions re "who’s in room?" coolest I’ve seen is small rooms & mods who check-in w/all periodically eg Maestro teleconf #p2chat^08/24/10 06:29 PM ET

intellitics@citizentools Think I agree. Both online/offline need to support overall participation objectives both have strengths/weaknesses. #P2Chat^08/24/10 06:31 PM ET

PublicDecisions#p2chat …I mean that selection of tool for online has different implications than regular f2f so diff chart would be useful^08/24/10 06:31 PM ET

citizentools.@PublicDecisions re tool/goal match – intervening var = process. Some not all processes can be shoe-horned into certain tools #p2chat^08/24/10 06:32 PM ET

intellitics@citizentools Distinction between on/off should be less rigid IMHO. Let participants use whichever mode works best incl. both. #P2Chat^08/24/10 06:33 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools so true about variable of process; although factors with online like sensory overload data that shld be considrd #p2chat^08/24/10 06:35 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat – agree w/"use which is best for you" & mods will do their best to ensure you’re not a second class citizen +1^08/24/10 06:35 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions That’s a matrix we’d *love* to work on at some point. Btw @ParticipateDB might serve as starting point! #P2Chat^08/24/10 06:36 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools LOVE Maestro! would be gr8 to compile list of synchronous and asynchronous for engmt diff impacts/factors 2 think abt #p2chat^08/24/10 06:37 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat thing is a given tools often imports a certain "culture". e.g. against Twitter culture but not tech to string^08/24/10 06:38 PM ET

citizentoolstogether 3 tweets to say something at greater length. #p2chat^08/24/10 06:38 PM ET

PublicDecisions@intellitics Sounds gr8! Would be glad to collaborate on! #p2chat^08/24/10 06:39 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat so would be interesting to sponsor "culture breaking experiments" (which could work with ParticipateDB actually)^08/24/10 06:39 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools intrsting pt about culture…do you mean culture of tool itself or culture of org or community that uses(or all/some)? #p2chat^08/24/10 06:39 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat e.g. have AmericaSpeaks or World Cafe push Ideascale and surrounding processes to the limits see what they can do^08/24/10 06:40 PM ET

citizentools.@PublicDecisions #p2chat mean "how ppl expect tool to be used even though techno permits something else"^08/24/10 06:40 PM ET

PublicDecisionsAgree @citizentools. would be gr8 to create "lab" to explore how tools work in certain processes vs others #p2chat^08/24/10 06:40 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions Several "tool selection wizards" exist. Most fall short. In the end a lot depends on process design/facilitation. #P2Chat^08/24/10 06:42 PM ET

PublicDecisions@intellitics would be great to compile list of those too; most I have seen don’t include full spectrum of asynch/synchr; agree? #p2chat^08/24/10 06:42 PM ET

PublicDecisionsAm really interested in mobile phone techn for engmt apart from keypads (old school now!); any new uses u know of? #p2chat^08/24/10 06:42 PM ET

citizentools#p2chat not at all expert on tool selctn wizrds but suspect tjey mostly as useful/less as “how to pick up person of appropriate sex” tips^08/24/10 06:43 PM ET

PublicDecisionslol @citizentools! yes there is parallel that could be made there! #p2chat^08/24/10 06:45 PM ET

citizentools.@PublicDecisions #p2chat re mobile phone engmt – http://app.beextra.org/ for volunteering e.g. pix tagging via smartphone^08/24/10 06:47 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions Mobile is another very interesting area. Don’t know nearly enough about current usage/use cases. #P2Chat #edem^08/24/10 06:48 PM ET

citizentools.@PublicDecisions harrumph. parallel is that both the "tips" seekers and the "wizard" users are asking the wrong question #p2chat^08/24/10 06:48 PM ET

PublicDecisionsFave new mobile ph techn sends med data in remote areas back 2 lab for analysis. Sim idea could work for rural areas w transp data? #p2chat^08/24/10 06:49 PM ET

citizentools.@intellitics #p2chat re participatedb – any thoughts on including "micro" processes – e.g how each tool might (not)serve brainstorming?^08/24/10 06:50 PM ET

PublicDecisionsOr other ways that citizens could co-produce/partic in policymking…BUT going beynd ClickItFixit #p2chat^08/24/10 06:50 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Didnotknow about BeExtra very cool!!Yes we shld b encourging this kind of collab IMHO in our p2 comm not just blogs #p2chat^08/24/10 06:52 PM ET

citizentools@PublicDecisions re beyond @seeclickfix in general see http://infovegan.com/2010/08/02/city-bankruptcy per @cjoh #p2chat^08/24/10 06:52 PM ET

PublicDecisions@citizentools Fascinating post on SeeClickfix! will read full article later. Int pt about incr cost of gov svcs due to more svc req #p2chat^08/24/10 06:54 PM ET

ParticipateDB@citizentools We hope to launch more capabilities soon to add such information. There are a lot of angles worth exploring! #P2Chat #edem^08/24/10 06:55 PM ET

PublicDecisionsWld be interesting to see what % req are taken on by citizens vs govt to fix #p2chat^08/24/10 06:57 PM ET

PublicDecisionsGr8 conversation @citizentools @intellitics! thanks 4 chance to chat 2night some cool things to think abt/work on in re f2f/online #p2chat^08/24/10 06:58 PM ET

citizentoolsGood night @PublicDecisions @intellitics Time for dinner w/my inamorata! #p2chat #schmooze^08/24/10 06:58 PM ET

PublicDecisionsThanks @citizentools! Am off to have a nice glass of wine myself. See everyone next wk same Bat-time same Bat station! #p2chat^08/24/10 07:01 PM ET

intellitics@PublicDecisions Ditto that was fun. Thanks everyone! #P2Chat #edem^08/24/10 07:04 PM ET

intelliticsNice! @amysue102 shares example of real-time three-way online/offline integration (F2F Skype SecondLife): http://bit.ly/bOsFsY #P2Chat^08/24/10 07:05 PM ET

mpeersRT @intellitics: We’re a participation startup from San Jos√© CA. We’re developing @zilino a new web app for online consultations. #P2Chat #opengov #edem^08/24/10 07:08 PM ET

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